TomCruise Posted February 10, 2018 Report Share Posted February 10, 2018 So I've come to the conclusion that buffered substrate is dumb. By the time the tank finally seems to get balanced the substrate becomes exhausted and i gotta start the whole process over. (I remineralize RO water). So I'm thinkin about just using a product with Humic acid in it to achieve a targeted pH? I've seen little humic balls and something called blackwater. But before i go and do something stupid, i thought I'd see if anyone here could tell me why this is a dumb plan first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyzazz Posted February 11, 2018 Report Share Posted February 11, 2018 What kind of buffered substrate have you been using? And what are you remineralizing with that your substrate is wearing out so quickly? You could always use a canister or sump system with buffered substrate in it, but I don't think that you'll be able to achieve a consistent pH without some sort of buffer. Humic Acid/Blackwater Extract alone isn't strong enough to drop pH appreciably and keep it there without it swinging too much for shrimp. Not to mention it will turn your water yellow/brownish. I'm interested to see if anyone else has a decent solution to this. Also, could we possibly have this thread moved to a different topic? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revaria Posted February 11, 2018 Report Share Posted February 11, 2018 If your remineralizing RO water then the buffering substrate theoretically shouldn't run out too fast, unless you are changing large volumes of water quite frequently. And you could always do the shoebox method and allow you to replace substrate out of the tank as necessary, if you don't want to create a mess as I do believe most substrates kind of exhaust after 6 months to a year. I also agree with wyzazz in that humic acid would not drop the pH very low, its essentially what the indian almond leaves release and it would take a lot to drop pH down significantly. In addition I am not even sure if blackwater extract drops pH, I think it is just concentrated humic acids anyway. The only methods I have really heard that would drop pH consistently would be large amounts of tannin filled decor, the buffered substrate or peat moss if you used it. I don't believe there is another way to drop pH consistently without swings in parameters. In the end if you are using RO water it should make the water neutral, so you could always keep your shrimp in that as stability is usually more important for shrimp even if its a little out of their favored parameters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fishnchips808 Posted February 16, 2018 Report Share Posted February 16, 2018 Like he said, peat moss and excessive amounts of IAL works, I have a Blackwater tank running right now and it takes about 40 leafs to get 6 gal to Blackwater standards, charcoal filters help remove the color but I don't run a charcoal filter in that tank EDIT: 40 small leafs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chappy6107 Posted February 16, 2018 Report Share Posted February 16, 2018 if going the black water route you would need to prepare the water ahead of time to prevent parameter swings/shock while the blackwater effect happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BubbaGump Posted February 20, 2018 Report Share Posted February 20, 2018 Check out the thread I pasted. I am trying peat pellets to avoid an active substrate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TomCruise Posted February 25, 2018 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2018 Thanks everyone. I realize I posted in the wrong place. I''k check out your thread Bubba Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGlassBox Posted March 6, 2018 Report Share Posted March 6, 2018 In order to succeed via this route, you need reeeally soft water. Very low KH (See BubbaGumps post). I hate to say it, but I tried what your trying to do about 2 years ago. I was trying to set up a temporary tank to breed cardinal tetras (which will breed better in soft/low pH water). Since it was only a temporary tank, I didn't want to pay for active substrate. I tried blackwater extract, huge amounts of leaves and peat pillows. I finally just gave up and set up another tank. I couldn't keep the parameters stable worth beans. So I figured it was an excuse to get another shrimp. My well water has a KH of 5 for a reference point. You may have better luck with if you have a low KH. I wish I could figure out a DIY active substrate... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyzazz Posted March 6, 2018 Report Share Posted March 6, 2018 9 hours ago, TheGlassBox said: I wish I could figure out a DIY active substrate... I think as DIY as we are going to be able to get is Akadama (Bonsai Soil). Purchasing it via Ebay it ends up costing more than Fluval Stratum per tank, but the cost ends up slightly less than something like Controsoil/Brightwell. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGlassBox Posted March 6, 2018 Report Share Posted March 6, 2018 7 hours ago, wyzazz said: I think as DIY as we are going to be able to get is Akadama (Bonsai Soil). Purchasing it via Ebay it ends up costing more than Fluval Stratum per tank, but the cost ends up slightly less than something like Controsoil/Brightwell. Yup. I've never tried it, but I've heard it works! I like a darker substrate though... Have to stick with Fluval... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyzazz Posted March 6, 2018 Report Share Posted March 6, 2018 It does work, and it works well! It doesn't leech ammonia like some substrates, but it does suck up minerals at first... ...it's odd to watch your TDS go down every day around 40ppm. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickAus Posted March 7, 2018 Report Share Posted March 7, 2018 On 2/17/2018 at 6:00 AM, chappy6107 said: if going the black water route you would need to prepare the water ahead of time to prevent parameter swings/shock while the blackwater effect happens. I prepare mine a week ahead. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGlassBox Posted March 7, 2018 Report Share Posted March 7, 2018 Something like that happened to me with my last bag of Fluval substrate actually... It pulled all the GH right out of the water! I kept adding Salty Shrimp GH+ up to 6 and the next day it would be at zero. So I added more to bring it up to 6, and once again the next day it was zero. Went on for a week and I finally just tossed the bag and got another one. It must have been an 'off' batch - it was nuclear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wyzazz Posted March 7, 2018 Report Share Posted March 7, 2018 59 minutes ago, TheGlassBox said: Something like that happened to me with my last bag of Fluval substrate actually... It pulled all the GH right out of the water! I kept adding Salty Shrimp GH+ up to 6 and the next day it would be at zero. So I added more to bring it up to 6, and once again the next day it was zero. Went on for a week and I finally just tossed the bag and got another one. It must have been an 'off' batch - it was nuclear! Wow, I'll have to watch out for that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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