K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Hello all, I set up a 20 gallon long with one bag of 9L Amazonia exactly a month ago and added Fluval's Biological Enhancer, but after 20 days there was still no nitrite or nitrate. The ammonia was around 2ppm after I did a 50% water change 10 days in, and it lowered to 1 ppm when I did another 75% water change about a week ago. Around that time I also added 2 vials of BioDigest and more of Fluval's Biological Enhancer (much more, out of disappointment), but so far for this entire week the ammonia level has stayed around 0.5-1ppm, nitrite has always been 0, and nitrate has been staying at 5ppm. I'm currently using an Aqua Clear 30 with Fluval's Biomax rings in it, and I set my heater to around 78 degrees Fahrenheit. It currently has no plants and 2 pieces of Malaysian driftwood in it. The last time I tested it, the GH and KH are both 0, and I've been using only RO/DI water to do water changes. The tank pH has been consistently around 6.4. It seems like my tank isn't really cycling, for if it is the nitrate level should be going up, and the ammonia level should be going down... Can any one help me discern where the issues are? Thank you to any one who may be able to help. JosephKex and Edwardnah 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyeGuy411 Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 A couple things that could help your cycle go faster is crank up your temperature. Try and get your temp to around 86 and rasie your pH to 6.8-7.2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glasshalffull Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 While I cycled my tank with Amazonia I used prime treated tap water after it cycled I switched to rodi remineralized RyeGuy411 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMG Aquatics Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 One important thing is, what exactly are you using to measure pH? If you are using API pH test, it is a very very inaccurate test. If you aren't using a calibrated pH probe, chances are your getting wrong pH reading. When I first got ADA AS, it buffered to around 4.5 I think? Bacteria grows quickest in pH above 6 or 7 and in high temperatures. RyeGuy411 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyeGuy411 Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 I always cycle any active substrate with tap water. Then switch to RO after the tank is cycled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayphly Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Maybe this will help http://www.shrimpspot.com/index.php?/topic/4065-step-by-step-cycling-techniques/ eozen81 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHe Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Use Seachem Stability Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 A couple things that could help your cycle go faster is crank up your temperature. Try and get your temp to around 86 and rasie your pH to 6.8-7.2 Thank you, but would that not be beyond the optimal temperature range for certain nitrifying bacteria strains? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 One important thing is, what exactly are you using to measure pH? If you are using API pH test, it is a very very inaccurate test. If you aren't using a calibrated pH probe, chances are your getting wrong pH reading. When I first got ADA AS, it buffered to around 4.5 I think? Bacteria grows quickest in pH above 6 or 7 and in high temperatures. I am indeed using API's pH liquid test. I bought a pH probe earlier, but it never worked properly. Do you have any recommendations for pH probes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Maybe this will help http://www.shrimpspot.com/index.php?/topic/4065-step-by-step-cycling-techniques/ Thank you for this incredibly helpful link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Use Seachem Stability I have already added a lot of BioDigest and Fluval's similar product, do you still recommend adding Stability? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyeGuy411 Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Thank you, but would that not be beyond the optimal temperature range for certain nitrifying bacteria strains? 86 F is the optimum temperature for the growth of nitrifying bacteria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RyeGuy411 Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Hanna instruments makes good pH probes. This one is ok and is not too expensive. Proper temp and pH are probably the two most important things to a fast cycle next to nitrifying bateria. http://www.amazon.com/Hanna-Instruments-Temperature-Compensation-Resolution/dp/B0085WUOGA/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1436478525&sr=8-8&keywords=hanna+ph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 86 F is the optimum temperature for the growth of nitrifying bacteria. I see. I have just increased the heater dial to 86. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 9, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 Hanna instruments makes good pH probes. This one is ok and is not too expensive. Proper temp and pH are probably the two most important things to a fast cycle next to nitrifying bateria. http://www.amazon.com/Hanna-Instruments-Temperature-Compensation-Resolution/dp/B0085WUOGA/ref=sr_1_8?ie=UTF8&qid=1436478525&sr=8-8&keywords=hanna+ph Thanks for the link Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChadO Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 I just glanced through the cycling guide, and it looks like it mentioned to set the temp to 72 when done, coming right down from the high temp to promote colonization. I didn't see that it mentioned going from the high temp down to the target temp in stages. I have heard/read, that a sudden, large temp swing could be harmful to the bacteria colony, and that it was better to drop the temp in stages - something like 2-3 degrees each day to hit your target temp and not "shock" the bacteria colony. I am not saying this is necessarily right, just asking if others had seen something similar, and if this sounded correct? Maybe it is possible that the colony does take a hit, but rebuilds so quickly that it is not technically an issue? Hard to know what is myth out there and what is true. If I can kill off another myth, all the better! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayphly Posted July 9, 2015 Report Share Posted July 9, 2015 This is my tank which was cycled with Amazonia in 20 days. These shrimp have now been in here 4 days and are all doing fine. I've tested ammonia for the last 3 days in this tank to make sure there are no spikes. All parameters are stable. If your adjusting parameters using an HMF I suggest you wait 24hrs after remineralizers have been added and then re-checking them. It takes some time for the jet lifter tube to draw all the water through the filter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 This is my tank which was cycled with Amazonia in 20 days. These shrimp have now been in here 4 days and are all doing fine. I've tested ammonia for the last 3 days in this tank to make sure there are no spikes. All parameters are stable. If your adjusting parameters using an HMF I suggest you wait 24hrs after remineralizers have been added and then re-checking them. It takes some time for the jet lifter tube to draw all the water through the filter. By HMF do you mean a hamburg matten filter? If yes, I'm not currently using one. I have not yet added remineralizers, could that impact the bacteria growth rate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesHe Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 I have already added a lot of BioDigest and Fluval's similar product, do you still recommend adding Stability? I found Stability is doing much better in acidic environment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 I found Stability is doing much better in acidic environment. I see. I have just purchased a bottle from amazon. Thank you for your input. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayphly Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 I don't think it impacts bacteria growth. You'll have to add minerals either way. I add mine once my tank has completed it's cycle. Edwardnah and JosephKex 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OMG Aquatics Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 One possible issue with these bacteria startups is the way it was stored, shipped, etc. According to Seachem, high temperatures and cold temperatures can damage the bacteria. I once had a thermometer shipped and the carrier hid it under my door mat. The temperature that day was 70s and when I opened the package, the thermometer was reading over 100F. Might be possible that bacteria startup works for some and not for some because of the way it was handled before you used it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 I don't think it impacts bacteria growth. You'll have to add minerals either way. I add mine once my tank has completed it's cycle. I see. I will add BorneoWild's GH up and raise the GH to 3 today. By the way, I have dialed temperature up to 86 F, would that impact christmas moss growth? I just tied them to a piece of Malaysian driftwood, and the water felt quite warm (I'm in SF). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K2Cr2O7 Posted July 10, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 One possible issue with these bacteria startups is the way it was stored, shipped, etc. According to Seachem, high temperatures and cold temperatures can damage the bacteria. I once had a thermometer shipped and the carrier hid it under my door mat. The temperature that day was 70s and when I opened the package, the thermometer was reading over 100F. Might be possible that bacteria startup works for some and not for some because of the way it was handled before you used it. I have never considered this possibility.. I live in SF and the temperature of my house is usually around 60s to 70s, and I store them in open areas. I hope that is acceptable for bacteria survival. mayphly 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mayphly Posted July 10, 2015 Report Share Posted July 10, 2015 I have never considered this possibility.. I live in SF and the temperature of my house is usually around 60s to 70s, and I store them in open areas. I hope that is acceptable for bacteria survival. I'm in Pacifica although born and raised in San Francisco. The longest it's ever taken for me to cycle a tank was close to 3 months. And that was recently with a product I never used before and following their directions. What other types of shrimp are you keeping? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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