KH 0 for mixed neos and CRS?

[tlarsen]

I am new to keeping shrimp. I have two tanks, both planted low-tech:

Tank 1: 10G, inert substrate (torpedo beach), pH 6.5, KH 0, GH 6, TDS 175, temp ~74

Tank 2: 2.6G, amazonia AS, pH 6.0 or less, KH 0, GH 6, TDS 150, temp ~74

 

I have breeding RCS in the 10g (several months now), and just added CRS. While the RCS are breeding, I'm not sure that too many are reaching adults. CRS seem fine so far (only been 24 hours).

 

I just added blue velvet neos and CRS to the 2.6g (it is a newly cycled tank). A few of the neos died already, but the CRS seem fine.

 

Both tanks have exclusively RO/DI water remineralized with SS GH+. My question is, do I need to do anything to raise KH slightly in either or both tanks? I'm not sure if this would help the survival and breeding of the neos? The blue velvets aren't cheap and I would hate to lose them, but don't know if I should go messing with the chemistry quite yet. Obviously I am targeting primarily the needs of the CRS so far.

 

Thanks!

[dao]

My simple advice is - leave the kH alone. 0 is perfectly fine, and allows you to keep neos and caridinas.

If there are any issues with young shrimp reaching adulthood and all your parameters are fine always check for NH3 no2 and No3. If your tank is well cycled, with good filtration usually only NO3 is of concern.

I have tanks with similar parameters(and also use ss GH+), and I need to say that my TDS is significantly lower with that GH - usually around 120-130, not sure what else is there in your water that causes the TDS to be that high.

I'm not a neo expert, but some claim that with pH below 6.5 they start to struggle.

[Mr. F]

KH 0 is okay as long as the pH is above 6.5. The shrimp don't need carbonate (KH) directly, it's purpose is to stabilize a higher pH. So if you pH stays stable throughout the day (+- 0.2) or so, no need for KH. I add a little during water changes, but the KH is always below 1.

I'd slowly add just a bit for the tanks so the overall tank has a KH between .5-.75 dKH (~9-13 ppm KH)

This is what I've had success with Neo
Nessies and fancy red tiger as well as
a mischling and blue dream tank.

[tlarsen]

5 hours ago, Mr. F said:

KH 0 is okay as long as the pH is above 6.5. The shrimp don't need carbonate (KH) directly, it's purpose is to stabilize a higher pH. So if you pH stays stable throughout the day (+- 0.2) or so, no need for KH. I add a little during water changes, but the KH is always below 1.

I'd slowly add just a bit for the tanks so the overall tank has a KH between .5-.75 dKH (~9-13 ppm KH)

This is what I've had success with Neo
Nessies and fancy red tiger as well as
a mischling and blue dream tank.

Thanks very much. What should I add, is baking soda fine to raise only KH? How should I calculate an amount to raise .5 dKH in only 2.6g? I guess I would need to get a more precise KH test kit to measure those amounts also.

 

Would you recommend it in just my aquasoil tank, or also the inert tank with pH 6.5? pH is quite stable.

 

I also have some Thai micro crabs which came out this morning - fun to watch!

[tlarsen]

5 hours ago, dao said:

My simple advice is - leave the kH alone. 0 is perfectly fine, and allows you to keep neos and caridinas.

If there are any issues with young shrimp reaching adulthood and all your parameters are fine always check for NH3 no2 and No3. If your tank is well cycled, with good filtration usually only NO3 is of concern.

I have tanks with similar parameters(and also use ss GH+), and I need to say that my TDS is significantly lower with that GH - usually around 120-130, not sure what else is there in your water that causes the TDS to be that high.

I'm not a neo expert, but some claim that with pH below 6.5 they start to struggle.

I really appreciate the advice. Not sure yet if I will leave it at 0 or try to target 0.5 - my test kit is not that precise, so I might already have 0.5 for all I know.

 

Do you think my higher TDS might be a problem? I forgot to mention that I have a small amount of tantora mineral rock that I put in the 10g about 6 months ago, so that might be raising it. I also have a small almond leaf in it. In the 2.6 g I have granite rocks. I believe these are supposed to be completely inert.They are both pretty heavily planted even though low-tech, so there is a fair amount of decaying plant parts. Both have spiderwood also.

 

Should I use more of the tantora mineral rock, or is this unnecessary since I am using SS GH+? What about almond leaves? Also, is there any consensus about whether I should be using carbon or purigen in my filters or not?

 

Thanks!

[Mr. F]

Thanks very much. What should I add, is baking soda fine to raise only KH? How should I calculate an amount to raise .5 dKH in only 2.6g? I guess I would need to get a more precise KH test kit to measure those amounts also.

 

Would you recommend it in just my aquasoil tank, or also the inert tank with pH 6.5? pH is quite stable.

 

I also have some Thai micro crabs which came out this morning - fun to watch!

If you add it to the aquasoil tank, over time the buffering capabilities of the substrate will be lost. With that type of system, the aquasoil is acting as a buffer to keep the water at a lower pH. KH does the same but at a higher pH, so you can add alkalinity to it, but it will lower the lifespan of the soil's buffering capabilities.

To reach your target, it's easiest to use a method of dilution. In your 2.6g let's say: if you want to do a 50% water change of the KH 0 tank, all you have to do is add 1.3 gallons of KH 1 water. The sum of the weighted averages of the KHs of the water will give you your target.

I'll explain mathematically so bare with me:

Target KH =Ko

Tank KH = Kt

Water change KH = Kc

Water change percent (as a decimal) = Vc

Tank water normalized to 1 (like a full tank)

Soooo,

Ko = (1 - Vc)*Kt + Vc*Kc

Your example with a 25% WC:

0.5 = (1-0.25)*0 + 0.25*Kc

0.5 = 0.75*0 + 0.25*Kc

0.5/0.25 = Kc = 2

So a 25% change with 2 KH water should raise a system of 0 KH to a system with 0.5 KH.

In words, your target KH will be the product of the KH of the new water and the percent of water changed plus the product of the percent of remaining original water and it's KH.

This will always get you your target no matter the percent water change you're doing. Remember tho, you will change GH and pH with any water changes, so be sure to be careful and do the same calculation for GH using the same percent of water change.

[dao]

19 hours ago, tlarsen said:

I really appreciate the advice. Not sure yet if I will leave it at 0 or try to target 0.5 - my test kit is not that precise, so I might already have 0.5 for all I know.

 

Do you think my higher TDS might be a problem? I forgot to mention that I have a small amount of tantora mineral rock that I put in the 10g about 6 months ago, so that might be raising it. I also have a small almond leaf in it. In the 2.6 g I have granite rocks. I believe these are supposed to be completely inert.They are both pretty heavily planted even though low-tech, so there is a fair amount of decaying plant parts. Both have spiderwood also.

 

Should I use more of the tantora mineral rock, or is this unnecessary since I am using SS GH+? What about almond leaves? Also, is there any consensus about whether I should be using carbon or purigen in my filters or not?

 

Thanks!

The tds itself is not a problem, it depends on what is there in the water.

It is best to check tds of the water you are using for water changes and compare with the tanks tds. I use 100-110 (makes gh around 5-6)tds for water changes and the tanks stays around 125 with mironekuton stone, some leaves and alder cones inside. 

 

As for Stones - afaik there are no inert stones. All will dissolve in water - some very slowly, others more rapidly and may influence water parameters. However all these changes should be reflected in a higher gh or kh in the tank. If there is minerał excess it can obviously cause molting problems. 

 

Bear in mind that plants do not guarantee low no3 - i had a heavily planted low tech tank which had a severe no3 problem - it was rising like 5ppm per couple of days which was crazy. Floating plants are however excellent to get rid of no3.