Using Active substrate.

[prismviolet]

Hi all, Im excited to be active on this forum! 

 

I am new to shrimp, and I dont have any atm, but I am setting up for them! 

 

I have a few questions about active substrate, and how it affects water chemistry... I hope you can be patient, but I did search, and couldn't find definitive answers that could help me. 

 

1. When using an active substrate that makes the KH basically 0, does this affect the balance of PH? I thought that KH was essential to keep the PH stable? Doesn't this defeat the purpose of having a buffering substrate? As the substrate removes the KH that buffers the PH!  I will be using RODI water that is remineralized to the parameters correct for Caridina shrimp what will the substrate be doing?

 

2. If i am topping up with RODI water that is 6.5 PH, and doing water changes that are remineralized to 6.5ph, 4dgh and 1dkh, what is the substrate actually doing besides being expensive gravel??

 

3. How long can i expect the substrate to last while using aged RODI water that is remineralized for water changes, and pure for top ups? Id hate to be replacing it every year, as that would mean having several spare "temp" tanks so i can replace /re-cycle the tanks ready for the shrimp. Not to mention EXPENSIVE!!! 

 

Just a bit of back ground information, I am pretty much home bound now, due to chronic illness, and fish are something i have always had and loved Im moving to shrimp as they are more accessable for me (small tanks that wont kill me to get into and clean!) I got rid of my large tanks, as I am out of space and carrying large amounts of water was killing me!  I am setting up a shrimp rack, that has 9 (16"x16"x16") tanks to replace my several large tanks. It will be set up on a dedicated shelving unit, and each tank will have its own Eheim 2213 and a  sponge filter (with lighting under the shelf unit). I am going to use heaters to for a temp of 23C, I wont need a chiller as the room is controlled year round at 22C! 

The build is going to be a slow process, once the shelves are manufactured, I will be adding 1 tank at a time, as I can afford it of course! But once I have one set up and running, the rest will be easy, as I wont have to buy all the tests, chems, remineralizers ect! 

 

DET aquariums on Youtube was my entry into the shrimp world!! 

 

My goal is to own and breed CRS/PRL.

 

Regards

[chappy6107]

1 hour ago, prismviolet said:

Hi Prismviolet,

  Welcome to the forum.  I am just going to copy and paste your post and answer your questions.  Keep in mind this is my opinion and by all means not the "must have to do" to keep happy shrimp.

 

1. When using an active substrate that makes the KH basically 0, does this affect the balance of PH? I thought that KH was essential to keep the PH stable? Doesn't this defeat the purpose of having a buffering substrate? As the substrate removes the KH that buffers the PH!  I will be using RODI water that is remineralized to the parameters correct for Caridina shrimp what will the substrate be doing?  Yes you will see the ph drop because of this. 

 

2. If i am topping up with RODI water that is 6.5 PH, and doing water changes that are remineralized to 6.5ph, 4dgh and 1dkh, what is the substrate actually doing besides being expensive gravel??   the substrate is absorbing the kh mineral/substance which is exhausting your substrate.  You should be using a remineralizer that only increases gh in order to make your substrate last longer.

 

3. How long can i expect the substrate to last while using aged RODI water that is remineralized for water changes, and pure for top ups? Id hate to be replacing it every year, as that would mean having several spare "temp" tanks so i can replace /re-cycle the tanks ready for the shrimp. Not to mention EXPENSIVE!!!   If you remineralize the kh then you will probably only get a year out of the substrate, if only remineralizing the gh then probably 2+ years.

 

Just a bit of back ground information, I am pretty much home bound now, due to chronic illness, and fish are something i have always had and loved Im moving to shrimp as they are more accessable for me (small tanks that wont kill me to get into and clean!) I got rid of my large tanks, as I am out of space and carrying large amounts of water was killing me!  I am setting up a shrimp rack, that has 9 (16"x16"x16") tanks to replace my several large tanks. It will be set up on a dedicated shelving unit, and each tank will have its own Eheim 2213 and a  sponge filter (with lighting under the shelf unit). I am going to use heaters to for a temp of 23C, I wont need a chiller as the room is controlled year round at 22C! 

I wouldnt even bother with the heaters personally.  It is great to hear that the room will stay the same temp all year long

The build is going to be a slow process, once the shelves are manufactured, I will be adding 1 tank at a time, as I can afford it of course! But once I have one set up and running, the rest will be easy, as I wont have to buy all the tests, chems, remineralizers ect! 

 

DET aquariums on Youtube was my entry into the shrimp world!! 

He is a well respected member of this forum as well

 

My goal is to own and breed CRS/PRL.

 

Regards

 

[edwin_the_elder]

12 hours ago, prismviolet said:

Hi all, Im excited to be active on this forum! 

 

I am new to shrimp, and I dont have any atm, but I am setting up for them! 

 

I have a few questions about active substrate, and how it affects water chemistry... I hope you can be patient, but I did search, and couldn't find definitive answers that could help me. 

 

1. When using an active substrate that makes the KH basically 0, does this affect the balance of PH? I thought that KH was essential to keep the PH stable? Doesn't this defeat the purpose of having a buffering substrate? As the substrate removes the KH that buffers the PH!  I will be using RODI water that is remineralized to the parameters correct for Caridina shrimp what will the substrate be doing?

 

2. If i am topping up with RODI water that is 6.5 PH, and doing water changes that are remineralized to 6.5ph, 4dgh and 1dkh, what is the substrate actually doing besides being expensive gravel??

 

3. How long can i expect the substrate to last while using aged RODI water that is remineralized for water changes, and pure for top ups? Id hate to be replacing it every year, as that would mean having several spare "temp" tanks so i can replace /re-cycle the tanks ready for the shrimp. Not to mention EXPENSIVE!!! 

 

Just a bit of back ground information, I am pretty much home bound now, due to chronic illness, and fish are something i have always had and loved Im moving to shrimp as they are more accessable for me (small tanks that wont kill me to get into and clean!) I got rid of my large tanks, as I am out of space and carrying large amounts of water was killing me!  I am setting up a shrimp rack, that has 9 (16"x16"x16") tanks to replace my several large tanks. It will be set up on a dedicated shelving unit, and each tank will have its own Eheim 2213 and a  sponge filter (with lighting under the shelf unit). I am going to use heaters to for a temp of 23C, I wont need a chiller as the room is controlled year round at 22C! 

The build is going to be a slow process, once the shelves are manufactured, I will be adding 1 tank at a time, as I can afford it of course! But once I have one set up and running, the rest will be easy, as I wont have to buy all the tests, chems, remineralizers ect! 

 

DET aquariums on Youtube was my entry into the shrimp world!! 

 

My goal is to own and breed CRS/PRL.

 

Regards

 

Hi prismviolet!

 

Welcome to the hobby! It's nice to see that you're doing the necessary research before diving into the hobby  That's not something that's done very often (guilty as charged!)

 

I hope the following statements will help to answer a few of your queries but they're just based on my past experience and some head knowledge on chemistry  so here goes!

 

1. Active substrate doesn't give you a kH of 0. Only RO/DI can give you that. The purpose of a buffering substrate is to ensure that your water remains soft (i.e.low pH) with some stability by only leaching a little bit of kH (0-2). And whilst KH does keep the pH stable, it also tends to raise the pH since the amount of carbonates increases the pH.

 

2. HAHAHA I like how you put it but yes, if you are able to keep your water parameters stable and soft enough, I see no issue in using a cheaper inert substrate. Just that personally, I only dose GH+ for my CRS so having that additional bit of kH in the tank gives me piece of mind that the next Aldercone or almond leaf I add into the tank wont cause the pH to plummet and the shrimp to kick the bucket

 

3. This is a very good but tricky question. It really depends on the brand that you decide to use and how deep the layer is. If you're looking to have the benefits of an active substrate without the hassle of having to change it out annually or bi-annually (on average), what many Asian shrimp keepers like to do is to leave the tank bare-bottom and add a smaller tupperware container equipped with a UGF and filled with active substrate of their choice. You may also fill the rest of the tank with inert substrate if you'd like so that the shrimp have some substrate to graze on. This gives you extra filtration capacity whilst ensuring that you can simply remove the tupperware when you need to and change out the substrate when needed without having to restart the whole tank  Here's a picture of what i was talking about:

 (though instead of using such a high tech glass box you could use a deep container! works the same  )

 

Do take note of how the filter is set up in terms of the layers (from bottom to top): UGF -> screen mesh -> Biological media --> screen mesh -> filterwool -> active substrate

 

Its set up this way to ensure that as the active substrate starts to break down it doesnt melt into the lower layers and cause the bio media or UGF to clog

 

Anyways, really glad to hear how shrimp keeping is helping to kill the mundane home life  Take care of yourself and all the best for that lofty goal of yours! We all have to start somewhere. Don't hesistate to ask any of us on this forum for advice. We're all really helpful and friendly around here  

[haroutvartanian63o]

i have a quick question. I kept my crs in fluval stratum with ro water and bee shrimp mineral. Lately i removed the fluval stratum because it got old and i exchanged it with regular substrate that doesnt buffer. I did this because i got tired of changing the vacuuming and cleaning it was a mess. With fluval my ph was at 6.2. Obv my ph is going to be much lower sinze ro water water and bee shrimp mineral doesnt have any kh. Here comes my question, To keep my ph stable around 6.2 without buffering substrate, can i use salty shrimp gh kh and bee shrimp gh together to add about .5 kh to keep my ph stable? What do you guys think? Ive dont the math and 25ppm of gh+kh and 100ppm of Gh+ would give me .5 kh , gh 6, and tds 125. If i dont use the kh , my ph drops to under 5 and i prone to ph swing since there is no buffering substrate, do you guys think buffering substrate is all that necessary for crs to live and thrive?