Jump to content

Help/advice needed


Recommended Posts

Ok I need help. Am I doing something wrong or what. I started a tank back in February cycled it a month and added cardina shrimp. My last shrimp died maybe a month ago. I used RODI water and remineralized with blue wizard. The gh 5/6. I could never get PH above 6. TDS I struggled to keep at 125. I tested TDS last week and it was at 126. Since there are no shrimp I slacked on top offs and water changes. I just went to top off the water and TDS was at 105. Shouldn’t TDS rise not drop? What should I do so it stays stable and I can get shrimp again? The substrate is SL aquasoil and it’s majorly planted and in need of a trim. 

4CE4174C-7467-48FC-AC5F-8756E6A66310.jpeg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Ro/DI water should be 0 tds. Do you dose that tank with ferts? Adding ferts would obs increase tds. If you want it stable, weekly w/c measured with tds pen its pretty ez. I'm also using sl aqua and its awesome.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GoneCrazy said:
1 hour ago, GoneCrazy said:

Ok I need help. Am I doing something wrong or what. I started a tank back in February cycled it a month and added cardina shrimp. My last shrimp died maybe a month ago. I used RODI water and remineralized with blue wizard. The gh 5/6. I could never get PH above 6. TDS I struggled to keep at 125. I tested TDS last week and it was at 126. Since there are no shrimp I slacked on top offs and water changes. I just went to top off the water and TDS was at 105. Shouldn’t TDS rise not drop? What should I do so it stays stable and I can get shrimp again? The substrate is SL aquasoil and it’s majorly planted and in need of a trim. 

4CE4174C-7467-48FC-AC5F-8756E6A66310.jpeg

 

Hey GoneCrazy!

 

Really nice tank! I'm surprised your tank isn't okay with that many plants :( 

 

Anyways, are you dosing any ferts for the plants? Co2? It's just a guess at this point but I think your plants absorbed the minerals in the water column which lowered the TDS (which is a rough estimate of the conductive mineral content & other organics) in the water and since you don't have any bioload in the tank, the TDS is dropping consistently.

 

Also, what is the TDS of your RO water? SL Aquasoil isn't typically known for lowering pH all that much.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

7 minutes ago, edwin_the_elder said:

 

Hey GoneCrazy!

 

Really nice tank! I'm surprised your tank isn't okay with that many plants :( 

 

Anyways, are you dosing any ferts for the plants? Co2? It's just a guess at this point but I think your plants absorbed the minerals in the water column which lowered the TDS (which is a rough estimate of the conductive mineral content & other organics) in the water and since you don't have any bioload in the tank, the TDS is dropping consistently.

 

Also, what is the TDS of your RO water? SL Aquasoil isn't typically known for lowering pH all that much.

 

The only fertilizer I used was Bing Tsau. No Co2 cause I didn’t want to deal with it. Fresh RODI TDS is 0. Plants are super healthy and growing like weeds. The snails are going good. Just the 32 shrimp I had didn’t fair well I’m assuming because of the TDS swings. I just need to figure how to keep it stable. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

11 minutes ago, GoneCrazy said:

 

The only fertilizer I used was Bing Tsau. No Co2 cause I didn’t want to deal with it. Fresh RODI TDS is 0. Plants are super healthy and growing like weeds. The snails are going good. Just the 32 shrimp I had didn’t fair well I’m assuming because of the TDS swings. I just need to figure how to keep it stable. 

 

I see. Did you top off you tank with RODI water?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 minutes ago, edwin_the_elder said:

 

I see. Did you top off you tank with RODI water?

 

That I do cause always thought adding remineralized would sky rocket TDS, but thinking about it now I’m loosing TDS so if I top off with remineralized RO the TDS should stay up. Ugh so confusing lol

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Plants and bacteria will also reduce mineral levels in your water if you aren't replenishing them regularly. 

 

Shrimps die for many reasons. Ammonia poisoning (young tanks), bacterial infections (common in warm tanks), parasites, fluctuating parameters, excessive nitrates, failed moltings, etc. Sometimes it just comes down to bad stock. Some of the bloodlines have been linebred for so long to maintain patterns/colors that they seem to suffer from a suppressed immune system. 

 

I wouldn't worry so much about targeting a specific TDS, as long as you have sufficient minerals, many of these shrimp can happily live in TDS ranges from 90-200 ppm. TDS isn't telling the whole story anyways, just that there's so and so many ppm of dissolved solids. Driftwood, leaves, plant waste, fertilizers, etc. all contribute to this. Many of us just use TDS as a rough guideline for water changes because we know where it should be because we started from a remineralized base. As long as it remains consistent, it shouldn't be anything to worry over.

 

As for ferts, as long as you aren't dumping KNO3 to achieve 20-40 ppm like the EI folks, you should be fine dosing ferts. I usually just add a little Flourish and some KH2PO4 to my planted shrimp tanks. I don't dose any nitrate because they hover between 5-10 ppm all on their own with the bioload and feedings. I do small weekly WC to keep it there. 

 

You didn't specify what caridinas you were keeping but generally taiwan bees/pintos do well at 3-5 GH, whereas crystals do better with a GH of about 4-6. These ranges aren't set in stone but have given me the best chance for fry survival. They seem to have an easier time shedding their molts the softer the water is... and molting they do a lot of the first few weeks.

 

ph is nothing to worry over. A tank can cycle just fine under 6 and maintain a bioload there. Seachem Stability is your friend here. I cycled mine in 5 weeks with a pH of 5.5 -6.0. Matter of fact, I don't have a shrimp tank with a pH of over 6. It has been said that the bacteria we need to worry about with caridina species doesn't do so well with acidic water. Combine that with temperatures under 73° F. and you won't have to worry about dosing antibiotics in your tank...ever. 

 

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, GoneCrazy said:

 

That I do cause always thought adding remineralized would sky rocket TDS, but thinking about it now I’m loosing TDS so if I top off with remineralized RO the TDS should stay up. Ugh so confusing lol

 

Well that's usually okay if you're topping off not more than 5-10% of your water. But since you have plants in there and you haven't been doing top offs or water changes, the plants removing minerals coupled with the fact that you just diluted your mineral content would lead to a drastic drop in TDS.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, madcrafted said:

Plants and bacteria will also reduce mineral levels in your water if you aren't replenishing them regularly. 

 

Shrimps die for many reasons. Ammonia poisoning (young tanks), bacterial infections (common in warm tanks), parasites, fluctuating parameters, excessive nitrates, failed moltings, etc. Sometimes it just comes down to bad stock. Some of the bloodlines have been linebred for so long to maintain patterns/colors that they seem to suffer from a suppressed immune system. 

 

I wouldn't worry so much about targeting a specific TDS, as long as you have sufficient minerals, many of these shrimp can happily live in TDS ranges from 90-200 ppm. TDS isn't telling the whole story anyways, just that there's so and so many ppm of dissolved solids. Driftwood, leaves, plant waste, fertilizers, etc. all contribute to this. Many of us just use TDS as a rough guideline for water changes because we know where it should be because we started from a remineralized base. As long as it remains consistent, it shouldn't be anything to worry over.

 

As for ferts, as long as you aren't dumping KNO3 to achieve 20-40 ppm like the EI folks, you should be fine dosing ferts. I usually just add a little Flourish and some KH2PO4 to my planted shrimp tanks. I don't dose any nitrate because they hover between 5-10 ppm all on their own with the bioload and feedings. I do small weekly WC to keep it there. 

 

You didn't specify what caridinas you were keeping but generally taiwan bees/pintos do well at 3-5 GH, whereas crystals do better with a GH of about 4-6. These ranges aren't set in stone but have given me the best chance for fry survival. They seem to have an easier time shedding their molts the softer the water is... and molting they do a lot of the first few weeks.

 

ph is nothing to worry over. A tank can cycle just fine under 6 and maintain a bioload there. Seachem Stability is your friend here. I cycled mine in 5 weeks with a pH of 5.5 -6.0. Matter of fact, I don't have a shrimp tank with a pH of over 6. It has been said that the bacteria we need to worry about with caridina species doesn't do so well with acidic water. Combine that with temperatures under 73° F. and you won't have to worry about dosing antibiotics in your tank...ever. 

 

 

 

 

I had: Blue Bolt, Red Bolt, BBK/Shadow Panda, Black Pinto Zebra, Red Pinto Zebra, Red Fishbone Pinto Mischling, Black Fishbone Pinto Mischling, Blue Bolt Mosura, and Black german

They came from typical caridina parameters, 6-6.5ph, 100-120 tds, 5gh, 0kh, 74F and I tried matching exactly. 

 

I did weekly water changes of 3 gallons not sure what percentage that would be but the tank is a fluval flex 15 gallon. Every week before the water change I would test TDS and they were always low so I’m guessing water wasn’t stable. There is no driftwood and the shrimp came from good stock. No signs of illness. They would be munching away one day and dead the next. What I thought were molts were the shells of dead eaten shrimp 😩

 

I dose Bing Tsau fertilizer when I remember. When the shrimp were alive I was using Aquavital and TM-1. I believe last time I tested Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate were all 0 which has me bugging. I used to register Nitrate then it disappeared. The tank was fully cycled before I added the shrimp. Once the plants started growing the Nitrates disappeared. I still feed the tank cause of the snails. Just not sure what to do to get the water to stay stable. Other than doing a massive plant trim. And my temp stays around 74/75*F

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9 hours ago, edwin_the_elder said:

 

Well that's usually okay if you're topping off not more than 5-10% of your water. But since you have plants in there and you haven't been doing top offs or water changes, the plants removing minerals coupled with the fact that you just diluted your mineral content would lead to a drastic drop in TDS.

 

When I still had the shrimp I was doing weekly water changes and daily top offs. The TDS would drop before the scheduled water change so I would mix the TDS higher but it would still plummet. Not sure if I’m explaining it right. I would mix the water so it read 125 TDS before the next water change TDS in the tank would read 109-115. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

53 minutes ago, GoneCrazy said:

 

I had: Blue Bolt, Red Bolt, BBK/Shadow Panda, Black Pinto Zebra, Red Pinto Zebra, Red Fishbone Pinto Mischling, Black Fishbone Pinto Mischling, Blue Bolt Mosura, and Black german

They came from typical caridina parameters, 6-6.5ph, 100-120 tds, 5gh, 0kh, 74F and I tried matching exactly. 

 

I did weekly water changes of 3 gallons not sure what percentage that would be but the tank is a fluval flex 15 gallon. Every week before the water change I would test TDS and they were always low so I’m guessing water wasn’t stable. There is no driftwood and the shrimp came from good stock. No signs of illness. They would be munching away one day and dead the next. What I thought were molts were the shells of dead eaten shrimp 😩

 

I dose Bing Tsau fertilizer when I remember. When the shrimp were alive I was using Aquavital and TM-1. I believe last time I tested Ammonia, Nitrite, and Nitrate were all 0 which has me bugging. I used to register Nitrate then it disappeared. The tank was fully cycled before I added the shrimp. Once the plants started growing the Nitrates disappeared. I still feed the tank cause of the snails. Just not sure what to do to get the water to stay stable. Other than doing a massive plant trim. And my temp stays around 74/75*F

 

 

 

With that many plants and if you have any hidden hardscape, you might be closer to 10-12 gallons of actual water. Swapping out 3 gallons puts you closer to a 25% WC, which can swing parameters quite a bit if you don't drip the water back in. Much better to do two 10% WC a week than one 20% WC. I would only do a 20% WC if my nitrates were climbing beyond 10 ppm... which you seem to not be able to keep nitrates in your water column. You have the opposite problem most of us have because many of us don't keep a heavily planted tank for our caridinas. This is more of a common practice for those that keep neos in a high tech environment. Not saying it can't be done but you really need to stay on top of plant maintenance.

 

74/75° isn't terribly high but it's better to keep temps under 73° with bee shrimp to minimize the risk of certain shrimp killing bacteria colonizing your tank. Some can fight it off but most will usually die within a few weeks time, long after parameters have been corrected.

 

Again, don't worry over TDS readings. If you feel the need to keep testing... keep checking GH levels. This is the only one you should worry about. As long as it's 3-5 dGH, your bee shrimp will be happy. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

12 hours ago, GoneCrazy said:

 

When I still had the shrimp I was doing weekly water changes and daily top offs. The TDS would drop before the scheduled water change so I would mix the TDS higher but it would still plummet. Not sure if I’m explaining it right. I would mix the water so it read 125 TDS before the next water change TDS in the tank would read 109-115. 

 

Yeah I understand what you mean. That's really quite perplexing 😕 But I think like madcrafted mentioned...

 

11 hours ago, madcrafted said:

Again, don't worry over TDS readings. If you feel the need to keep testing... keep checking GH levels. This is the only one you should worry about. As long as it's 3-5 dGH, your bee shrimp will be happy. 

 

TDS should only be used as an estimate of your water conditions and for water changes with RO water. However, if you wanna really be sure that your water's fine, just make sure that your GH is stable. This is because certain minerals may contribute to a higher TDS reading but not to GH to in your case, the TDS might be dropping by quite an amount, but your GH might be stable.

 

If you can get your hands on some, I suggest keeping some tigers to test the parameters before you head out to get the more sensitive strains since tigers are generally more hardy.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So I just tested GH and it is at 6 which is a tad to high, but it’s holding stable apparently. 

 

Are the minerals that go missing important? I was feeding food with calcium and a slew of other foods as well. On top of adding aquavital and TM-1. 

 

Here is my plan if it sounds good. Do a big water change and get the GH back down to 4/5 and majorly trim plants. Then let it run another couple weeks doing daily top offs and twice weekly 1 gallon water changes. 

 

I’m not really wanting to do tigers again as I did them in the past with no problems. I also had CRS and CBS multiplying like rabbits. Which it why I’m at a loss as to why all the shrimp died. But as you guys mentioned my water changes might have been to big even though the water added back in was added back over a 3 or more hour period. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

yeah big water changes on a shrimp tank can cause problems.  for me, I have 10g tanks.  I do weekly 10%(1gallon) water changes.  I drip the new water as well as top offs through an airline with a control valve on the end @ roughly 1-2 drops per second.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...